If they can pull them out, they can also drop fresh ones down.<p>Not sure if that is better than just using a helicopter however.
> Not sure if that is better than just using a helicopter however.<p>Anyone who has done first responder training should have had it drilled into their skulls to remember the number one rule .... "do not add yourself to the injury list".<p>If you're operating in a war-zone its kind of the same thing. Send in a helicopter to drop off one or more guys and you are also sending in bare minimum of one extra person but realistically almost certainly three extra people (two at the front and one at the back to watch the people jumping out).<p>Also drones are probably somewhat cheaper than helicopters. Both to buy and to operate.
Because it's not America with Vietnam/ Iraq war mindset.<p>Helicopters are extremely vulnerable for drone interceptors. With Recent developments, the an interceptor can fly up to 600 km/h. It can also wait for you on the balloon.<p>Overall, piloted aviation, it's almost a dead end with all the recent capabilities.
Piloted aviation is still very much alive. US and Israeli 5th generation aircraft took minimal losses in the recent strikes on Iran despite some fairly capable defenses. Drone capabilities will continue to improve but for now the autonomous flight control software is incapable of complex, dynamic missions and remote piloting doesn't work in a hostile EW environment. We'll increasingly see manned/unmanned teaming with the drones pushing forward while the manned aircraft trail behind, but close enough to exercise tight control.
Probably harder to hit six single-soldier carrying drones than one helicopter.
A lot of the wounded soldiers that are getting these heroic evacuations have lost weight, months of combat and limited nutrition, blood and limb loss.<p>Fresh soldiers, with a combat load, might be too heavy. Or simply risky
Can not see the drone and shoot it down using thermal camera or ir seeking missile
I hope in the future all wars are fought by drones. Just don't make them unstoppable like in that Horizon videogame.
It reaffirms that Ukrainians are:<p>1. very advanced with drones
2. caring about their soldiers<p>Disclaimer: I am a proud Ukrainian.
Another Ukrainian innovation using drones: transporting transplant organs.<p><a href="https://ukrspecsystems.com/blog/pd-2-uav-tested-for-organ-delivery-by-heart-institute" rel="nofollow">https://ukrspecsystems.com/blog/pd-2-uav-tested-for-organ-de...</a>
I think this has been done before, as early as 2022, according to this article: <a href="https://globalnews.ca/news/8583562/drone-delivery-organ-transplants-canadian/" rel="nofollow">https://globalnews.ca/news/8583562/drone-delivery-organ-tran...</a><p>I'd actually assumed it'd be commonplace by now, but I can't find too many stories about it.
Not exactly the same but Zipline has been transporting medical supplies in Africa for almost a decade (in the US I think they're mostly focused on food delivery which is more profitable)
<a href="https://time.com/5295821/ziplines-drones-are-saving-lives/" rel="nofollow">https://time.com/5295821/ziplines-drones-are-saving-lives/</a>
To be precise, innovation doesn't mean <i>invention</i>. I never claimed that Ukraine was the first to invent organ delivery, but it definitely keeps innovating in this field.<p>Anyway, the point is that there is a lot of interesting/innovative going on with regards to drones in Ukraine.
NGL, reading this gave me the feels...<p>Also, next wartime invention: air mines.
The German company Avilus has shown a medevac drone, I don't know if it's been used to transport a live human (even uninjured) for a test yet.<p><a href="https://www.xponential-europe.com/en/Media_News/Magazine/Articles/%E2%80%9CGrille%E2%80%9D_medicopter_Rescue_drone_for_transporting_injured_soldiers" rel="nofollow">https://www.xponential-europe.com/en/Media_News/Magazine/Art...</a><p><a href="https://www.google.com/search?num=10&client=firefox-b-d&hs=pPqq&sca_esv=fd197440f8bb2449&sxsrf=APpeQnv-FB1CmL2uJ4rwy2GhTIkti45E5Q:1792437841763&udm=2&fbs=ABfTbFVyMZGZf1hfvX9uKjN_-G8c4u0nXx4bEIpwm1lnNH832VstEKsVDqPorK0Gahnm2nq-aQnTz_mBV-EZYISbLc-StUIq_PhL7hb0Qt0YiIGOHkJjnTZ-cOFt4MBdBh9xxUSLmQqYmceNOVPnJ828B2jVF7369v0TJ7PslRO7NeHq_gersSL0dF9_aQb9YBem2DXpczx9t0eeLk_LAjFQmfrB7VpT0w&q=avilus+medevac+drone&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjCitym58aXAxWUdTIDHWZfA_QQtKgLegQIGRAB&biw=1680&bih=940&dpr=2" rel="nofollow">https://www.google.com/search?num=10&client=firefox-b-d&hs=p...</a>
As a Ukrainian, I really wish my country could innovate in areas other than evacuation of wounded people from our own soil.
They are many... you should be proud. I am.<p><a href="https://ukraine.ua/invest-trade/ukrainian-inventions-that-changed-the-world/" rel="nofollow">https://ukraine.ua/invest-trade/ukrainian-inventions-that-ch...</a><p>And the recent drone tech is saving many lives and lots of money.
From outside it seems that Ukraine is not really given a choice right now but to defend itself. I wish for a soon end to the war so your beautiful country can prosper again and your people can start healing.
Doesn't this have potential applications in disaster relief?
is this not a good innovation?
It's a good innovation.<p>The whole situation that required that innovation is not.
It is a good innovation in the same way a shield is a good innovation. Perhaps people do not always want to innovate in the area of war, but instead doing something else, but they are forced to innovate like this.
Was it two years ago, or even longer, that Akhmat troops claimed Ukrainian drones tried to abduct their men in the field? Who knows, it might end up actually happen one day. Wild.
Pretty horrifying prospect really. Imagine the buzzing of a huge drone descending upon you from nowhere, before it just grabs you with its metal arms, and whisks you away into the sky, lol.<p>Guess it's better than dropping nades on top of you, maybe :/
It wouldn't need to drop grenades. It could pick you up, fly high enough, and drop you to your death. Never runs out of ammo, just batteries.<p>This is pretty horrifying. Bonus points if you hit somebody on the way down?
If a drone wanted to kill you, it would use a bullet. Cheapest and easiest way, with the least risk to the drone.<p>The extraction case would only be for high-value targets (enemy military/economic/political leaders), where having them alive would give leverage on having them order their organizations to do something useful for the drone owner.
Bullets are probably more economical.
for the Russian soldiers, it would certainly be a better fate than remaining on the field for a few more tens of minutes before they die (on average). AFAICT, they are treated better in Ukrainian POW camps than in the Russian deployed positions
A net shooting drone that pops an expanding weather balloon would get anyone you need off the ground and then plenty of time to collect then while they are floating around
Active discussion: <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50155237">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50155237</a>
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Please don't post political/ideological rhetoric on HN. It doesn't matter how correct your position is or how correct you feel it is; it only leads to back and forth arguments between people on opposing sides, and that's just what we're trying to avoid. Please aim for curious conversation at all times here. <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html">https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html</a>.<p>We detached this subthread from <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50156201">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50156201</a> and marked it off topic.
Setting aside the politics and the personalities, if we focus on the technology and the lessons in how to produce, iterate, and deploy I think there's enormous value in looking at what Ukraine has to offer from a tactical and strategic standpoint. It's a fact that countries and organizations are rushing to benefit from that aspect of this war, from NATO states to organized crime. Unless we imagine that data from this war isn't being actively pursued by any party that thinks they have the ability to adapt their local conflicts to a "new way of fighting", it's a matter of intense intellectual curiosity.<p>Doubly so when we recall that drones and ML are inextricably linked on the modern battlefield, and the technology we routinely discuss here is already being used in kill chains, ISR, SAR, and it's evolving on a weekly basis.
Sure, and there's a place for discussion about that (though whether HN can host such a discussion without it spiraling into a hellish flamewar is not something we can be confident about).<p>That aside, in this context the issue is that the comment very much didn't set aside the politics and the personalities.
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That’s an issue that can be debated at the appropriate time and place, but it’s not the topic of this article, so it’s a generic tangent and flamebait, which the guidelines specifically ask us to avoid.
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The article is about the use of a drone to evacuate an injured soldier from a battlefield. It’s not an article about geopolitics, and if it was, it would definitely not belong on the front page, because the guidelines clearly state that mainstream news is usually off topic here.<p>> Have the curiosity to be serious.<p>Excuse me. This site and its guidelines have existed in a largely constant form for almost two decades and your account is a couple of months old. Of course we welcome new participants here, but this is only a place where people want to come to discuss important topics because we have guidelines and uphold them daily. Please respect the guidelines and the community expectations if you want to participate here.
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Please stop acting like a jerk, thanks. There’s nothing new or clever about people playing games with words or logic to make the case that the guidelines should be reinterpreted or changed to allow the thing they want.<p>Off-topic tangents and political/ideological battle are always forum-killers. HN is only here after two decades because we work so hard to avoid it.<p>If you have an actual new idea on how to make HN more interesting, you’re welcome to share it. Otherwise, please stop wasting everyone’s time.
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat</a><p>>Use of kompromat has been common in the politics of Russia[7] and other post-Soviet states<p>Surely they wouldn't do the things that they usually do with Trump, who visited Russia in 1987 upon invitation by, more or less clearly, the KGB?<p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Links_between_Trump_associates_and_Russian_officials" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Links_between_Trump_associates...</a>
I wish “even Republicans” but that party stands for nothing any more, it isn’t even conservative. It’s the most bizarre and morally bankrupt thing I’ve seen in American politics and I’ve been paying attention since the 80s.
No need for dirt. Putin simply funnels money to Trump and that's enough.
> even Republicans are beginning to wonder what dirt Putin has on Trump.<p>What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?<p>Not trolling or rhetorical; that's a completely sincere question. Even if something "bad" were to surface, his supporters would simply deny it and/or ignore it, same as they've done for all the other things he's done that are already known.<p>You can pretty much divide American voters into two camps right now: the ones who loathe him and the ones who DGAF (non-voting voters being in the latter category).
> What dirt could they possibly have on him that would actually matter to the voters that voted for him last time?<p>Some segment will always deny any dirt that comes out but I think most would become fairly adverse to him if, say, conclusive evidence of child sexual abuse surfaced.
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Confusing comment. What foreign dictator are you referring to?
Supporting Ukraine’s defense against invasion has had better ROI than most domestic defense spending. For a pittance we’ve let a major adversary weaken itself considerably. We should do more.
“Back on”? When did it stop?
They probably will, but they won't get the votes to override a presidential veto (2/3 of both chambers). The very best case scenario is that Trump is impeached and Vance doesn't have any serious kompromat.
isn't impeachment without removal just a bullet point on a wikipedia page? i don't see it being very much of a deterrent.
It's possible that enough Republicans will be looking for a clean break with Trump and may be willing to get Vance in his place, especially with Trump's recent dealings with Russia and Ukraine. The MAGA voting base is looking less devoted with the recent economic developments as well and might not be so keen on his candidates in 2029. Also, if dems get the majority we may be seeing more Epstein revelations in the news.<p>But like I said, this is the very best case scenario. Most likely Trump will just be to busy handling an investigation and an adversarial Congress to do much but make noise on social media.
Vance is of a generation where he lived a good chunk of his life on social media and his mobile phone, so embarassing secrets could be picked up more easily by nation-level actors. It's possible that any politician of this generation in any country in any political party might be more susceptible to blackmail than the geriatric generation represented by Trump.
Vance is very isolationist and anti-Europe. He has said his proudest achievement is stopping aid to Ukraine. He says he wants peace but the implication is through the surrender of Ukraine. He is seen as worse than Trump.
I think the European countries' leadership are well aware that if Russia is not decisively defeated in Ukraine now, returning every square meter of UA territory back to Ukrainian control, they'll be fighting the Russian army in actual NATO locations even further west in 2, 5 or 7 years from now.
Europe are already fighting Russia. Russia has made scores of "hybrid war" attacks throughout Europe and GB, including attempted bomb-laden drones at Leipzeig airport, cutting numerous undersea cables, and even "errant" drone attacks. They are also likely behind amplifying the current unrest in France.<p>EU politicians don't want to acknowledge the ongoing war because they think it would be an escalation and they also have a fear of 'Russia breaking up'. Other than the Baltic states, they don't realize the only way to stop it is push back, hard and fast, as Ukraine is doing. The Russian military is low-capability and declining, reliant now on North Korea and Iran, and the economy is sliding. The reality is little could be better than Russia breaking up and finally abandoning it's imperial ambitions, which are still active today.
What do you mean "The Ukraine war is back on for Europe?"
You aren't deadlast, you are dead wrong. On every point.<p>The Ukrainian war never stopped. Russia has never paused attacking for even one day, in more years than WWI. The War on Ukraine never went away and so can't "come back"<p>No one supporting Ukraine is supporting a foreign dictator. Zelenskyy was elected in a free and fair election, and elections have been involuntarily suspended while the country is under continuous bombardment targeting civilians. Holding an election would be literal suicide and condemning voters to death by announcing every time and place where people would gather, just to make it easy for Russia to target them. And there is ZERO question — Ukrainian civilian casualties are NOT collateral damage, they are deliberately targeted by Russian missiles, long-range drones, and individual civilians are even hunted by FPV drones in "human safari" incidents posted by Russians themselves.<p>Ukrainians are only defending their own right to live on their own land under their own government, and not have their children kidnapped and their neighbors and themselves tortured and slaughtered, which has happened in EVERY city Russia occupied. Russia is doing what Russia has always done — invade and genocide a neighbor, then say "this was always Russia".<p>It is absolutely disgusting that you come here to post such lies and characterize any support for Ukraine as if it were support for an autocracy, when YOU are the one supporting Russia's autocracy. You are factually wrong and morally abhorrent. Rethink your life.
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