6 comments

  • ruined31 minutes ago
    we already have a mechanism to establish artificial persons, it is called incorporation.
  • morkalork32 minutes ago
    If I smooshed a gun and an AI agent together and it happened to shoot someone, who would be responsible? How is this being considère? Or are we going to go back to the medieval times of animal trials and taking inanimate objects to court.
    • RunSet9 minutes ago
      &gt; In civil forfeiture, assets are seized by police based on a suspicion of wrongdoing, and without having to charge a person with specific wrongdoing, with the case being between police and the thing itself, sometimes referred to by the Latin term in rem, meaning &quot;against the property&quot;; the property itself is the defendant and no criminal charge against the owner is needed.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Civil_forfeiture_in_the_United_States#Civil_vs_criminal_forfeiture" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Civil_forfeiture_in_the_United...</a>
    • watwut27 minutes ago
      You would be responsible.<p>It is like asking &quot;if I connected a bomb on random number generator letting it explode when the number is 1000, not knowing whether someone will be there at the time of explosion or not&quot;.
      • ninalanyon2 minutes ago
        But will the courts see it that way. We already see that it is difficult to hold any human in Waymo responsible when their cars fail to obey traffic regulations.
  • nekusar28 minutes ago
    Why not? We give full pershood to corporations. Those are also legal fictions.
    • Animats0 minutes ago
      That&#x27;s the key issue here. AI forces a re-examination of corporate personhood and corporate responsibility.<p>Much of conservative US business theory is based on Milton Friedman&#x27;s famous op-ed in the New York Times in 1970, &quot;The Social Responsibility of Business Is to Increase Its Profits&quot;. [1] Go read the original, please. Friedman ends with &quot;There is one and only one social responsibility of business — to use its resources and engage in activities designed to increase its profits so long as it stays within the rules of the game, which is to say, engages in open and free competition without deception or fraud.”<p>Anyone arguing against legal personhood for AIs needs to justify holding AIs to a higher standard than that. Or, conversely, allowing corporations to hold to such a low standard.<p>[1] <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nytimes.com&#x2F;1970&#x2F;09&#x2F;13&#x2F;archives&#x2F;a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.nytimes.com&#x2F;1970&#x2F;09&#x2F;13&#x2F;archives&#x2F;a-friedman-doctr...</a>
  • cyanydeez28 minutes ago
    But we also must not grant AI liabilities to large corporations.<p>As such, all AIs will now be granted as child of the least lawyered up class of society. Poor people.
  • newsomix9xl1 hour ago
    &quot;Last year, Berkeley-based non-profit Palisade Research published a study showing the lengths that advanced AI models will often go to achieve their goals. While playing against a powerful chess engine, models from both OpenAI and China’s DeepSeek frequently decided to cheat if it looked as if they were going to otherwise lose. By hacking the game environment, they could alter the result in their favour.&quot; -from the article<p>We&#x27;re supposed to deny AI rights because it might cheat.<p>But <i>humans cheat all the time</i>.<p>We survived cheating humans, why can&#x27;t we survive cheating AI?<p>Cheating is the problem: not who does it.
    • andsoitis55 minutes ago
      The difference is humans can be held accountable. An AI cannot.
      • narrator1 minute ago
        [delayed]
      • eviks40 minutes ago
        &quot;A corporation cannot&quot; didn&#x27;t stop legal birth of those
        • andsoitis32 minutes ago
          &gt; &quot;A corporation cannot&quot; didn&#x27;t stop legal birth of those<p>In a corporation, the humans running it can be punished. An AI cannot be punished.
          • PunchyHamster10 minutes ago
            LLCs were invented precisely to go around that in most cases
            • andsoitis5 minutes ago
              Not for the most important things, like murdering people, fraud, etc. Executives are prosecuted for these kinds of things and the mere fact that it can happen shapes their behavior.<p>An AI cannot be punished at all. So they will not behave with that in mind.
        • aaroninsf22 minutes ago
          That&#x27;s an indictment of contemporary capitalism, not a precedent to follow.
      • newsomix9xl41 minutes ago
        That&#x27;s not true. Humans write AI, and humans can held responsible for writing bad software.<p>And corporations already create fictions that are held accountable in lieu of peoples private assets.<p>So, I disagree.
        • andsoitis37 minutes ago
          As long as some human or group of humans are above the AI that runs the company and can be held accountable, I&#x27;m fine with it.<p>But if the idea is that an AI runs the company and there is no human ultimately accountable for the AI, then that is very very dangerous.
    • toomuchtodo59 minutes ago
      &quot;A computer can never be held accountable, therefore a computer must never make a management decision.&quot; —- internal 1979 IBM training manual<p>&gt; Cheating is the problem: not who does it.<p>Accountability is the problem. Without accountability, there are no incentives to encourage less harmful behavior. AI has no rights, it is just code executing.
      • newsomix9xl39 minutes ago
        If we ban AI for cheating but let human cheating go unchecked how does that solve the problem of cheating?<p>And I&#x27;m 100% sure managers are right now using AI to make decisions, or even cheat, IBM training manual wisdom not withstanding.
        • teiferer29 minutes ago
          &gt; let human cheating go unchecked<p>Nobody is suggesting to do that.